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Post Info TOPIC: Jags Autorx/Synthetic oil Test
Shelby likes Autorx


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Jags Autorx/Synthetic oil Test
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I can't seam to find if this made it to the new Forum or not, but I remember Jag gave me permission to post it on the Autorx forum.  Sorry if this is a repost, but I think this is a very significant test showing the potential benefits of Autorx even when used with Synthetics.  Thanks again to Jag for doing this on his own.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=796968&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1



book.gifHigh Temp Deposit Tests - M1, GC, Auto-RX mix
      #796968 - 01/08/07 05:02 PM
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Disclaimer: I am not affiliated or paid by any company to do testing on oils. I do tests out of my own interest. I'm posting this to provide information that I find useful enough that others should know about it.

These are the results of high temperature deposit resistance tests that I performed last week on 3 virgin oils: Mobil 1 0W-40 (API SM), Green GC, and a mix of 5% Auto-RX and 95% Mobil 1 0W-40 (from same bottle as in other sample). This ratio of Auto-RX to motor oil was chosen to be similar to what is used during the cleaning phase of an Auto-RX treatment. I put 2.00 grams of each oil into separate anodized aluminum cups along with one clean, uncorroded penny per cup. I then placed the cups on an upside down clothes iron that gets the oil temps to 330F (measured with a thermocouple). I weighed the cups before the test and after each hour to get volatility data. I took pictures of the pennies still in their oil cups to show the onset and progression of deposits. This test ran for 9 hours.

In the pictures below, you'll see "M", "MA", and "C" written next to the cups or the pennies. "M" is M1 0W-40, "MA" is the Auto-RX / M1 mix, and "C" is Green GC.

The penny in the M1 0W-40 cup started getting deposits between 2.5 and 3 hrs. The deposits got worse and worse as hours passed. The Auto-RX / M1 0W-40 mix didn't start to form deposits on its penny until between 4.5 and 5 hours. As more time went on, the deposits on the M1 0W-40 penny formed at a much faster rate than those on the Auto-RX mix penny. The Green GC penny did not show any deposits until between 7.5 and 8 hours. The pictures below show the pennies at various stages of the tests to show the onset and growth of deposits of each penny.

After 9 hours of testing, the pennies were removed and cleaned with soap and water to prepare them for very good photographs and a closer look. The M1 0W-40 penny is completely covered in a tough, crusty (hard) layer of deposits. Under 10x magnification, it looked nasty and showed that the deposits are like thousands of little spheres piled on top of each other and vary in color from grey to black. The color of the deposits on the Auto-RX / M1 mix penny are somewhat different than those on the other two pennies, possibly indicating that they are composed of different chemical species. As noted already, it had a different (slow) growth pattern as well. Interestingly, the anodized aluminum cups themselves did not have any deposits, not even varnish so the copper on the pennies must have acted as a catalyst for some kind of reaction (scientists know that it's an oxidation catalyst for oils). There is copper in engines so deposits on the copper in these tests are not irrelevant. The iron, aluminum, and lead in engines actually make the catalyst effect even stronger. However, these tests are not designed to accurately simulate oil aging in an engine.

I also noted the oil odor. The M1 0W-40 got a foul odor early in the test...first observed after only one hour. Green GC did not smell foul until after 6 hours. The odor comes from the reaction products of the oil so it's a sign of thermal degradation. By the end of the test at 9 hours, M1 smelled quite horrible while Green GC smelled mild and like burnt corn. At 9 hours, the Auto-RX / M1 mix smelled less foul than the pure M1 0W-40 did but more foul than GC did. This finding suggests that perhaps Auto-RX's esters slowed down the thermal and oxidative degradation of M1 0W-40. Anyhow, this theorizing doesn't matter as the deposit results are what really count.

As previously stated, volatility data was collected and as I expected from past tests, M1 0W-40 was considerably more volatile than GC. After 4 hours, M1 lost 0.165 grams while GC lost 0.105 grams. Auto-RX had essentially no effect on the volatility of M1 0W-40 as the Auto-RX / M1 mix lost 0.160 grams to evaporation in 4 hours. Volatility trends in later hours were the same as in the first 4 hours.

Summary: Green GC showed much better high temperature deposit resistance on copper than M1 0W-40. It is significantly less volatile as well. Adding 5% Auto-RX significantly reduced the onset of high temperature deposits of M1 0W-40 and greatly slowed the rate of deposit deposition once they started. Auto-RX had essentially no effect on the volatility of M1 0W-40. The inventor of Auto-RX was not aware that Auto-RX would have this benefit for preventing high temperature deposits. He was aware that it can clean up dirty piston rings, but these findings indicate it likely has the ability to keep relatively clean piston rings even cleaner compared to using pure motor oil. That is, it may benefit piston rings in new engines as well as engines with some life on them. Turbocharger deposits are another high temperature area that Auto-RX can likely help based on these results.

Future testing will likely be designed to determine the effect of Auto-RX on Green GC's high temperature deposit resistance as well as determine how effective smaller dosages of Auto-RX are. Additionally, adding iron and aluminum metal pieces to the copper in the oil is planned to add additional catalysts.

Below are the links to the pictures along with a description (time and anything noteworthy) for each picture.

3 hours - onset of M1 penny deposits
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/3hrs.jpg

4 hours - M1 penny deposits grew considerably
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/4hrs.jpg

5 hours - onset of "MA" penny deposits
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/5hrs.jpg

8 hours
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/8hrs.jpg

8hrs - close-up of GC (onset of deposits) and "MA" penny
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/8hrs-closeup.jpg

9 hours - close-up of GC penny
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/9hrs-closeup.jpg

9 hours - degreased pennies
https://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/groftja/DSC01986-a.jpg


-- Edited by Shelby likes Autorx at 21:42, 2007-06-25

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BrianWC


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Good post by JAG. The man is a tireless experimenter.

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Frank Miller


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The misconception that Auto-Rx wont clean with synthetic oil is just that. There is one additive in all synthetic oil's whose main function is to hold the host oil to the metal. YOU DON'T WANT THIS WHEN YOUR TRYING TO RINSE OFF CONTAMINANTS FROM METAL. THIS WHY WE ASK YOU USE A NON SYNTHETIC OIL FOR RINSE MODE.


WE TRY AND MAKE THE APPLICATION SIMPLE ALSO WALMART SUPER TECH OIL NON-SYNTHETIC IN COMBINATION WITH AUTO-RX IS AS GOOD AN OIL YOU CAN GET FOR A NON TECHNICAL RINSE MODE.


IF YOU HAVE A TURBO GO TO A GROUP 111 OIL (ONLY BECAUSE IT WILL CERTAINLY EASE YOUR MIND ABOUT TEMPERATURE OF YOUR ENGINE) WORKS GREAT WITH AUTO-RX IN ALL STEPS OF APPLICATION AND IT IS A GOOD OIL TO STAY WITH.

-- Edited by dbdeland at 13:45, 2007-07-02

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