Auto-Rx Customers Questions & Answers

mlapaglia · Member

2nd owner chevy cavalier - 125k miles with 1 oil change..

geeaea · Senior Member

I'm worried about damage I'm not seeing, whether it's clogged return ports or sludge blocking performance somewhere else. Is ARX going to be a good fit for this type of problem, will the standard "sludge removal" instructions work or should I follow something different?

The sludge removal process should work just fine. Just keep in mind that there are physical limits to what can be contained in the filter and what can be suspended in the oil. The best I can tell you is to alternate 3k oil change intervals using Auto-Rx on every other oil change. After the 2nd you can take a break and see what additional cleaning will occur at that point. Consider it an extended rinse phase. You may consider changing the first filter out at 500-1000 miles and cut it open. If it's plugged solid (actually, plugged liquid), then continue to change the filters at 500-1000 miles. There's no worries about the engine losing lubrication. Just filtration.

Will ARX be able to unclog a blocked port?

Over long enough time. It will take a very long time to erode a truly clogged passage. Without being constantly refreshed, such casual contact isn't nearly as affective as passages under forced circulation. Where the oil is flowing more or less constantly, there Auto-Rx can work. I doubt you have an plugged pressurized passages. There you would shortly damage whatever was being supplied. In terms of drain passages, you don't appear to be filling up the top of the engine and having it spew out the PCV vents.

My second concern is with the transmission. It has no doubt never been serviced, probably still running on factory fluid and filter. I've read changing/flushing the fluid can have negative effects if it has never been serviced and is over 100k. When I accelerate quickly, my RPM's go very near/into redline between 2nd and 3rd gear. The transmission sort of "hangs" before it shifts. Can ARX help with this because my engine has over 100k miles on it, or am I screwed either way because changing the filter and fluid might cause problems for my transmission even if ARX helps get some of the gunk out?

No worries about the fluid exchange. The myth is from too many people not servicing their trans until problems occur. They finally change the fluid hoping it will fix it. The trans fails shortly there after, which it was going to do anyway.

Use Auto-Rx as directed and exchange your fluid. I don't think your hanging is necessarily a problem with the trans other than some smaller engines have higher stall speed converters that may allow the engine to wail away until the car catches up in output speed. If you lift your foot off, I assume that it shifts normally.

Richone · Senior Member

Looks like you did a heck of a manual cleaning job on the top[end of this motor. Did you find that the solvent used easily drained down through to the pan.? And are you going to drop the pan? Suprizing sometimes the pan is not neartly such a mess. I would think it would be a good idea to take a peak at least and check out the oil pick up screen.

As long as your motor can circulate oil through its intended paths, ARX is by far the safest product to use. If you clean up the oil pan as good as the valve train, you might be able to get great results with only one cleaning and rinse.

Sounds like sticky shifting valves in you trans. I would expect that can be solved in short order.

onthefritz8 · Veteran Member

Don't forget to replace the PCV valve and make sure it's working correctly. Just curious, did you figure out where the oil is going if you put in 5 quarts and it doesn't show up on the dipstick? At least in my thinking if it's not showing up on the dipstick I'm surprised the engine isn't toast by now.

Frank Miller · Guru

ME TO. IN FACT IT IS AN ENGINEERING MARVEL. IF YOU CAN ABUSE AN ENGINE L IKE THIS AND KEEP IT RUNNING TO AN OWNERS SATISFACTION GM SHOULD BE SELLING THEM LIKE HOT CAKES.

PLEASE LET US KNOW I F YOU PURCHASE AUTO-RX I WOULD LIKE TO FOLOW YOUR PROGRESS AS EVERYONE ELSE WOULD I AM SURE.

PLEASE READ THE WEBSITE AGAIN IT WILL GIVE YOU CONFIDENCE IN AUTO-RX ABILITY TO CLEAN SLUDGE.

mlapaglia · Member

idea to take a peak at least and check out the oil pick up screen.

The solvents did easily flow into the bottom of the engine. I will be dropping the oil pan this weekend, cleaning it, and checking the screen for replacement if needed.

Yep I was going to keep a close eye on my oil + filter to make sure they aren't ready for an early change.

Yes after I lift my foot off of the gas it'll shift into the next gear. I've never held it down long enough for the engine to stay 6000 rpm for more than 1.5 seconds because it's kind of scary..

Oil does drain from the top to the bottom, when I first took it apart there was no visible liquid oil. I HAVE been getting oil out of the "breather" port that exits into the intake manifold. I am going to check again at the end of the week (for the first time since I've manually cleaned it) to see if the oil is still coming from there. the 2.2L ecotec doesn't have a PCV valve but it does have an oil seperator, so I don't know what else could be causing it to spit oil..

Thanks a lot for the responses! I'm going to be purchasing 3-4 bottles this evening.

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Wednesday 15th of September 2010 04:55:51 PM

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Wednesday 15th of September 2010 06:14:02 PM

Richone · Senior Member

With all the crud that had formed on the valve train, who knows where all the oil got directed to. It might have been splashing right at the breather port. Or with all that crud that would put a flow of oil much closer to the port. I am real curious to see what the bottom end of the motor looks like.

That ecotech motor is just about as close as you can get to bullet proof, from what I am seeing.

mlapaglia · Member

A friend of mine at work use to work at a GM dealer. He said once they tried to destroy a sunfire's engine (same as cavalier) that they were going to chagne out. He drained the oil and replaced it with engine oil, and could not even get it to misfire after 100 miles. I'll be dropping the pan on saturday afternoon, pictures will ensue. Yesterday evening I was able to see oil on the dipstick, so it must be sludge in the bottom blocking it somehow..

Also, does anyone know if I get a tracking number with my auto-rx order? Getting ancy :)

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Thursday 16th of September 2010 05:32:34 PM

Frank Miller · Guru

UPS generates tracing number it could be in your trash folder ? e-mail me the name you ordered in and the date. I will have another tracking e-mail sent to you

FYI Auto-Rx could not collapse a lifter the idea is to finish the complete application than post your results.

Until you have finished the complete application you have no idea as to results.

mlapaglia · Member

Where did I say arx collapsed a lifter? I got my UPS tracking number a few hours after I posted that, so no worries :) It'll be here halfway through next week. I'm trying to show a before-after comparison that's all.

I went under the engine today. The cavalier's oil pan is attached to the engine mounts, the transmission, and the alternator.. I don't think I'll be removing the pan anymore, as this is a bit out of my league.

geeaea · Senior Member

Yeah, they sure do complicate things. Here you are, totally willing to pull the pan ..and they make it so "you can't get there from here".

Frank Miller · Guru

Customer comments and photos. good-bad & ugly.

Just thought I'd let you know I'm very impressed by the results I've had using Auto-Rx. I've documented my experiences so far in my blog, given your product two posts so far.

If you're interested in what I've written, here is where you will find the posts:

http://almostgonesblog.blogspot.com/2010/02/experiment.html

http://almostgonesblog.blogspot.com/2010/09/update-toan-experiment.html

-- Edited by Frank Miller on Monday 20th of September 2010 02:46:40 PM

-- Edited by dbdeland on Monday 20th of September 2010 05:31:34 PM

-- Edited by dbdeland on Tuesday 21st of September 2010 09:11:24 AM

mlapaglia · Member

Got my ARX in the mail today, went ahead and added 15 oz. to the engine with a fresh change (changed the filter last week) and 6 oz. to the transmission. I drive roughly 300 miles a week so it should be around 2 months when I'm ready to change. I'll be checking the filter weekly (it's probably going to get clogged quickly no doubt). Autozone has a deal right now where you buy 5 quarts of oil and you get a filter for free, so I'll be cashing in on that.

I put my car through it's paces before ARX so I can compare to afterwards, and even after 10 miles I notice during acceleration there is a noticeable repetitive "lunging" who's period decreases with speed. After I let off the gas it goes away. I'll be making notes during daily drives to and from work anything I notice.

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Tuesday 21st of September 2010 07:49:30 PM

mlapaglia · Member

Update: Currently sitting around 650 miles on my first phase of ARX. I've been noticing oil coming into my air intake via the PCV breather port coming out of the valve cover into the intake. I researched online to find this port should be sucking air in, not blowing air out. I found that the 05 Cavalier doesn't have a PCV valve, instead has an outlet in the bottom of the head that goes directly into the intake manifold. If this port is clogged up, air will eject from the breather (with oil in it) instead of sucking in. I took my intake off today, with a tiny hole the size of an carborator cleaner red straw clogged with oil crud. After a nice cleaning session the breather port is now sucking in air! I added a little less than a 1/2 quart of oil (mostly because of the oil issue I just fixed) to get my oil back onto the dip stick reading.

As far as ARX is concerned, the oil filter is not getting too dirty yet, and parts of the oil are still opaque (as compared to **** black like a week after the previous oil change. Probably around next weekend I'll get my transmission fluid flushed once I am near 1,000 miles.

onthefritz8 · Veteran Member

Don't know if you are aware of this but according to the tranmission part of this website you can leave Auto-RX in for up to 3,000 miles if it's been used under harsh environment which it sounds like this car has been. If the previous owner was that neglectful with engine oil the tranny has probably been abused as well.

mlapaglia · Member

I did notice that onthefritz8, but something has come up. I managed to drive to work today fine, but on my lunch break I did a u-turn, and my transmission started to slip.. The revs were increasing without my speed going along with it. It felt and sounded similar to when you are shifting gears in a manual and you are not letting the clutch out enough to catch. This problem persisted for a few minutes in 1st gear until I parked and took someone else's car to lunch. Later that afternoon I drove home, I noticed it happening in 4th gear on the highway, I was going around 65 and the rpm's started going over 3 - 3.5 (normally it stays right at 2.5). I slowed it down to 60 and the problem went away. After I got off the highway the problem stopped occurring.

With the symptoms coming and going, is the likely culprit crud being dislodged by ARX and clogging/blocking something temporarily until it's caught in the filter, or are my gears worn down? I'm not very educated in this area so any advice would be appreciated. I've scheduled to get my transmission flushed by a chevy dealer on monday, I'll be explaining the situation before hand to see what they think the correct course of action should be.

bmwtechguy · Senior Member

On a really dirty, neglected/high mileage trans, I generally try to get some new fluid in there before adding the ARX. Before finding ARX, I would flush the unit with new, cheaper Dex III and then run that a few thousand miles before dropping the pan, change the filter, clean up, etc. Then, finally, refill/flush with the correct or whatever better quality fluid I decide to run in there. The big difference is that now I use 6 oz of ARX for 1000-3000 miles in there with the new Dex III to do some real, thorough cleaning before the final fill/flush.

I have wanted to help a friend do this on his very neglected 93 Chevy truck trans for some time, but he said he had not serviced it in 170k miles that he was afraid to do it. Well, today he called and said the trans had failed. I was not surprised.

johnoh · Veteran Member

mlapaglia wrote:

With the symptoms coming and going, is the likely culprit crud being dislodged by ARX and clogging/blocking something temporarily until it's caught in the filter, or are my gears worn down? I'm not very educated in this area so any advice would be appreciated. I've scheduled to get my transmission flushed by a chevy dealer on monday, I'll be explaining the situation before hand to see what they think the correct course of action should be.

Treating very old trans fluid with autorx (or just changing out very old fluid) is always a gamble because of situations like yours, as any change in the transmission operation can result in symptoms that are disconerting. The good news is that those symptoms will almost surely be short-lived and you will be running better than ever soon. Those who say don't change/treat the fluid at all are recommending that you continue to use old and chemistry-depleted fluid, and that means a shorter transmission life - so you its a risk if you do something and a risk if you do nothing. You are on the right track, just stay with it.

In the future, a slow change to the fluid is the way to go. Start with a drain and fill that only changes 1/3 to 1/2 of the fluid, then later add autorx, then later do a full flush. That way you change things gradually.

mlapaglia · Member

I will keep that in mind johnoh and bmwtechguy, thanks for the tips! I just got back from the dealer today with a freshly flushed transmission :), although it was quite a pain, the service tech never called me, and it took two days to get the job done.. Either way it's done now, I'll make some remarks if I notice anything different with the performance (I wasn't really expecting anything, I'm just trying to make my car last a while).

I do have one question, I asked if they dropped the pan and looked at the filter, which they did not do. Will a flush clear the filter out on it's own or should I take it down this weekend and have a look?

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Tuesday 5th of October 2010 05:05:24 PM

geeaea · Senior Member

All suction filters are pretty much sieves, mlapaglia. When you find stuff sitting in the pan it's because it cannot stay in suspension and it basically forms its own "river delta" of a sort. Many don't even have filters anymore and have gone back (this was once this way for all automatics) to a wire screen. It does make you feel better with it changed ..no argument there, but it's become mostly unnecessary. That's not to say that better filtration would not be of benefit. A magnefine added to the cooler line can help keep fluid clean and catch some stray stuff.

bmwtechguy · Senior Member

Yes, given the choice of dropping the pan to drain the fluid in it and also changing the filter, followed by a refill that results in half good/clean fluid and half dirty/worn-out fluid
vs a complete system flush via cooler lines, I would take the complete flush any day.

For example, look at the millionmilevan.com guy. He had them flush the tranny with reg fluid every like 40 or 50k miles and it lasted well over one million miles. The suction filter is there to catch big chunks that could wipe out a pump, not to keep the fluid clean. In his case the fluid was kept relatively clean by replacing it completely every so often.

mlapaglia · Member

Thank geeaea and bmwtechguy for reassuring me :). Ok it's been one week since the transmission flush, and I just hit 1k miles coming home from work today. Here are some findings. The engine idle has been going in between a normal idle and a little rough of an idle on some days, other days it's fine, and it's only audible before putting the car in drive. There is still no oil in my intake (hurray) which means cleaning out the port in the intake manifold was a success. When I accelerate quickly there is still burnt oil coming out the exhaust, still not sure what is causing that. No performance degradations with the transmission, it could be placebo but I believe during regular acceleration the shifting is smoother and less noticeable. I changed the oil filter (I got a bunch free with an autozone deal), which had a little bit of build up in it and probably didn't absolutely need to be replaced, but I did it anyway.

1/3 of the way there! Can't wait to remove the valve cover again and see what ARX has been up to inside my engine :)

mlapaglia · Member

Would just like to chime back in. After running through a course of auto-rx, I was still having issues. It ended up being the oil control rings on my pistons being gunked up. It seems it was too much for auto-rx to handle. Here's a big picture to show the detail.

I have a lot more pics up on imgur. Full list of pics here http://mlapaglia.imgur.com/cavalier_tear_down

I am up to 145k now with no oil burned after the oil control ring replacement.

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Thursday 15th of September 2011 07:19:04 AM

-- Edited by mlapaglia on Thursday 15th of September 2011 07:22:36 AM

Frank · Senior Member

geeaea (Gary Allan passed away a few months ago) guess you did not know. Looking at these photos how many cleaning applications using Auto-Rx did you do ? assuming rinse cycle was 3000
miles each cycle ? did you stay with synthetic blend for entire Auto-Rx Application ? Please answer.

mlapaglia · Member

I did two treatments at 3,000 miles using synthetic the whole time. By the looks of it I would have needed several more treatments for something to occur.

Richone · Senior Member

Just a couple of thoughts. You mentioned that you ran 2 treatments with synthetic oil. That is no optimal for ARX to work well in heavy duty cleaning. ARX works well with only mineral oil based motor oils. That would include conventional oils and some group III oil base stocks in our approved list of synthetic oils, which do not contain high levels of polar ingredients. The other question that I have is how much sludge was present in the oil pan when you dropped out the piston, pictured in your prior coorespondence. It is quite possible that the ARX cleaning phase additions were consumed with just dissolving massive amounts of crud in the oil pan and along the walls. If that was the case, then it is highly likely that the crank counterbalancers were just splashing around a bunch of degredated multi year old oil. It is quite possible that you had the volumetric equivalent of a quart or more of sludge just lining the walls of the oil pan. In which case the ARX bottle of only 1/3 of a quart would exhaust rather quickly. I would agree that the piston shown and oil control ring are far from clean. However, if the oil control ring was severely worn then I am not suprized at the condition in the picture. We can't fix broken or worn out parts. The amount of oil passing by up to the the intermediate ring would be continuing to bake it to death as you ran the motor.

Not having any pictures of the rings and lans of the piston prior to starting the procedure does not allow me to make a determination as to whether or not cleaning in your host oil was effective, or whether the rings were already toast when you started. It is also pretty hard to tell if your oil flow draw up towards the filter was sufficient to flow oil through the filter properly or whether the filter system was running in the bypass mode.

Please get back to us on what synthetic oil it was that you ran your clean and rinse phases in. Oil companies are always changing formulations and marketing names.